Running in

[fast_ed_68]

My new baggie should arrive this weekend. Having never owned a new vehicle in my life, can anyone give advice on runing in. I'm sure the manual will have details, but worried it might be 'minimum possible inconvenience to the user' to avoid putting people off, rather than what's really 'best for longevity of the bike'. Or am I just being paranoid?

[cdfisher]

Break-in periods for motors are really about proper seating of the piston rings against the cylinder walls. We break many bikes in on the dyno and it seems as though everyone you ask has a different approach. The rule of thumb is don't lug the motor, allow it to cool completely after running it and change your oil at or before the prescribed interval.

Manufacturers procedures for break-in are designed for the general public who are assumed to be able to follow the path of least resistance to a goal, which in this case, is wearing the microscopic grooves in the cylinder wall down to an acceptable level.

Drag racers have been doing it since the begining; rebuilding a motor and breaking it in before the next round. But that is different from a new engine break-in. Here is what Larry Kelly has to say about some of the differences in the Ducati.net forum: http://www.ducati.net/faq.cfm?id=51

Do a search on Google for "engine break-in" if you really want to read more opinions about breaking in a motor. Everybody has an opinion, and if you're unsure about the direction to take, follow the manual.

I hope this info helps...

[phlat65]

I did not do anything real special, just no long WOT runs until 1,000 miles or so. try to stay below red line, and don't lug it.

I have 12,000 on mine, and it still runs the same as when I picked it up. it uses very little oil (normal) and makes no noises.

just do what you think is best..

[DAVID THOMPSON]

hi
my rt 125 was run as normal from day one just keeping
the rpm under 5000 rpm for the first 1000 miles
then at about 1500 miles i took it on a 8 hour 300 mile trip and then 2 days
later the 300 mile return
staying in the 50 to 55 mph area and under 8000 rpm
it did not seem to get loose till about 4000 miles

it now is at 10,000 miles in under 3 years and runs super nice but some day
it will probely make a big noise ..
i run it at 60 to 65 mph on road trips and that's 9000 to 9750 rpm
for 5 to 8 hours
so if you guy' s hear a big noise some day in july or august 2005
you will know what blew up

[fast_ed_68]

Exscuse the dumb question but...

Does "Don't lug it" mean "Don't make the engine work hard at low revs?"

I'm from England, you see and it's not a term I'm familiar with.


Many thanks for the replies.

Cheers,
Stew.

[DAVID THOMPSON]

hi

on a 660 i would always try to have at least 2500 4500 rpm
in any gear
no 5th gear at idle stuff
try not to get stuck too long in stop and go city traffic even after break in

my saxon tour idles at about 20 mph in first gear
need i say i dont run short trips in town with it
its for the superslab

[MSW]

I'm no mechanical genius, and when I bought my Baggy this spring, I had many of the same questions.

So I started searching around the net, and the most informative site I found was this one:

http://www.mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm

Being the skeptic that I am, I searched and searched for arguments against this guy's theories, and what I came up with was two basic categories of rebuttal:

1. The manufacturer built the engine, and have built thousands like it over the years, so if they say to do it a certain way, we should follow their advice.

2. Whether or not the manufacturer's way is better, they might void your warranty if you don't follow their instructions, so you should follow them.

That didn't seem too persuasive, so I followed this guy's advice. Note, however his admonishments that you should NEVER over-rev the motor, and always follow proper warm-up procedure. That's good advice no matter what procedure you use.

I imagine that if I've really f'd up my motor, I might not know it for months or years, but it sure runs beautifully right now. Very strong. And after approx 3k miles, no strange noises.

Anyway, that's just my $0.02. And that's probably what it's worth.

MSW

[cdfisher]

Yeah, I read this guy’s site as well. However, I shied away from citing it because he had some incorrect information on the dyno section. He stated, “On a dyno, the water temperature will become high enough to cause it to boil out of the radiator after
about 4 dyno runs.”, if your dyno room has adequate air exchange and auxiliary fans for cooling, then you can run a bike for hours without overheating it. He kind of prefaced his remarks a bit, but nevertheless, overstated the issue.

My partner Dan Prindle used to break-in race motors on the dyno in Chicago at 4 & 6 Performance and it takes a couple of hours of constantly monitoring temperature of the motor, the gases from the exhaust, and even exhaust temperature to wait for everything to line out and stabilize.

Every rebuilt motor is different and factory built motors, while in a sense, are “rebuilt”, there is an expansion and contraction sequence that takes place for the first time to a factory motor involving the different metals and gaskets that really isn’t “heat cycling” as this gentleman explains it. Heat cycling may have its roots in shop mythology as he writes about it, but heat is a factor in any internal combustion engine and should be considered from a long term perspective as metals change properties with age as this little excerpt from an Amsoil site explains:

The engine break-in issue is the subject of much controversy as everyone seems to have their opinion on when an engine is considered fully broken in. The information we provide is based on the results of engineering studies as well as many years of experience and teardown analysis on test vehicles. The differences between a vehicle that was properly and fully broken in and one that was not can often be hard to detect, yet there are tell-tale signs of this but they are not easily detected except in all but the most extreme situations. The subject of what occurs during the break-in process can easily be the subject of a 100 page report therefore what we cover in this website page is only the essential points you need to know. The break-in process we describe here is nothing compared to the extensive break-in process that race car engineers go through before an engine is ready to be converted to AMSOIL as well as racing in competition.

Breaking in an engine is a process of properly wearing-in the pistons/cylinders/rings, bearings, valves, camshaft, lifters, rockers, etc... In addition, part of the breaking in process is not only wearing-in and seating the internal engine components but also stress relieving the components as well. Crankshafts, connecting rods, pistons, blocks etc... have many stresses due to the casting or forging process, machining and welding process. We have viewed and measured these stresses, called fringes, using what is called lazer holography. These stresses are properly reduced/eliminated by costly and time consuming heat aging as well as shot peening and or high frequency vibration on a very specialized bedplate for an extended period of time. For production applications this is cost and time prohibitive. Therefore, the next best thing is exposing your engine to multiple heating and cooling cycles under various load and RPM's, which is described in the following paragraph. The heating and cooling break in process continues over a period of time and does not need to be run on petroleum oil.

Breaking in a new engine is the one area that petroleum oil is better for than synthetics. You see, petroleum oil has a very low film strength which is ideal for breaking in a new engine. That is why we recommend you run the factory installed petroleum oil for about the about the first 500 miles. Then drain the oil, remove the factory installed oil filter and then install AMSOIL Synthetic motor oil and an AMSOIL Super Duty oil filter and your ready to go.

Further heat cycling break-in will continue during the multiple heating and cooling cycles from driving your vehicle under varying RPM and engine load conditions and then shutting it down for a long period of time to let it cool completely. The multiple heating and cooling cycles are a extremely important factor in properly breaking in a new engine and are often an overlooked factor in the total break-in process. These heating and cooling cycles achieve what is called stress relieving. Back in the "old days" of engine manufacturing, after casting and before an engine block was machined, it would be set outside for several months to age, during which stress relieving occurred naturally, then the block was machined, which helped to produce a better engine than one that was machined immediately after casting.

Granted, it’s about the proper oil to use, but there is far more engineering “meat” in this article than the “claims” on the Motoman site. Actually, I think this guy has it mostly right, but the problem is that many folks aren’t capable of following directions correctly, even as simple as his (of course, EVERYONE on this site excluded) . That’s why the manufacturers have “dumbed down” the procedure to a simple formula that even your kid can follow.

Okay, I’m done with this topic. I better quit before I begin citing Society of Automotive Engineers (SAE) documents and studies.

Oh, and the Motoman site? I'm going to create a temporary email address and submit it for his newsletter. If it's not a spam address selling site I will let you all know. If it is I should begin recieving spam on that address within 24 hours or so and I will warn you against it (I hate spammers!).

Great response MSW, and I’m sure your bike will be fine for the long haul.

[MSW]

Again, I'm no mechanic, but aren't the break-in procedures that the Motoman guy refers to and the "heat cycling" described in the Amsoil article two different processes? In other words, wasn't that guy's website referring to the proper seating of the piston rings in the cylinders, whereas the Amsoil article is referring to the proper "curing" of the metal components themselves (e.g., rods, pistons, etc.)?

I took from my very little and very informal research that the most basic and important task in the break-in process was making sure that the rings seat properly, and that the surfaces of the pistons and rings "mate" more efficiently, so that there will be less oil blow-by and a tighter seal (and, theoretically, more HP).

Of course, I also understood that the Motoman guy was saying that heat cycling itself was a myth, which seems a little fishy to me.

In any event, best I could tell from my "research" was that both were important (ring-seating and heat cycling), but that novices such as myself could do more harm than good by trying to do heat cycling and doing it wrong, so maybe it's just best to work on ring-seating and leave it at that.

Anyway, my bottom line was that the Motoman guy's theory that you need pressure on the rings to create a more tightly mated surface between the rings and cylinders seemed sound, so that's why I tried it.

Good stuff from the Amsoil site, cd. Thanks.