Shipping fees?

[Blathian]

when i bought my 2005 baghira, i was charges 5194 for the bike, plus 400 crate fee? and 100 assembly?? is this common for a dealer to charge the shipping and assembly fees?

[phlat65]

yes, very common. usually listed as "F&S" in their adds.
what I don't get is the Big fancy yamaha dealer here charges like $600 for F&S, and the bikes are shipped into seattle by boat from japan.

[DAVID THOMPSON]

i worked for a guy in the 1970's that did not charge F&S
but list pice for the bikes this way he could under sell other
dealers and butler and smith could not yell at him for cutting the bikes
price B&S got real mad if you discounted one

i have a problem with the big mc makers they put the shops
so close together that some of them starve

[cdfisher]

This can be a touchy subject for customers and dealers alike.

All dealers are charged shipping fees for each bike delivered no matter what. Some distributors have a scaled quantity for shipping, if a dealer buys enough bikes from the distributor all at once or on a scheduled program, then they may get a break or free shipping. The dealer may choose to pass those saving to the customer, but normally they keep the money (by charging the customer) because the dealer pays for the shipping from overseas in the price of the bike no matter what. It's in the price he/she pays from the factory.

Then there is the setup and testing for each bike. When was the last time you bought a bike, rode out onto the highway and the front wheel fell off? Or maybe the chain was so loose it was skipping on the sprocket teeth. No doubt this has happened to someone out in the world, but a good dealer pays competent people to assemble the bikes, road test them and then tighten up nuts and bolts that the factory may have missed. Sometimes the bikes have been stored for so long that the carbs need cleaning. All this takes time and money. The big 4 (Honda, Yamaha, Kawasaki, Suzuki) give their dealers estimates of how long it should take to assemble a bike and they range from 1 to 3 hours depending on the bike. At a shop rate of $65-$85/per hour, this adds up. The Sales Department pays for its support in service in any well run business so the Sales Dept. is getting charged when a bike is assembled. My point is, many people are part of the chain of fulfillment to supply bikes to the public, everybody works for pay (do you work for free?) and the dealer has to make money to stay in business. 'Nuff said.

The margins are so thin for new bikes and people are constantly shopping by price and not value, so some dealers will add exorbitant amounts on for FS&S (Freight-Setup&Safety Check) and then advertise low sales prices to get people in the door. It’s the same with the internet, low price, high shipping. Here’s a dealer secret: There is more money in used bikes than new. Most give it a safety inspection, a wash, and push it out to the line (we don’t, but read our Certified statement on our web site for more…). However the money is in the brand name products and dealers accept all the baggage that comes with their brand(s) of choice. Some dealers take advantage of the customer’s lack of knowledge and may very well get away with charging huge fees that don’t reflect the true cost of services (read value), but most dealers will come down if the customer negotiates. Remember, “caveat emptor” or “Let the buyer beware” is your best bet when shopping for even a toaster these days.

Anyway, at our shop, we have an approach like your Saturn dealer. We charge whatever the shipping charge was, then add an hour of labor to the bike. For the smaller bikes the shipping runs around $100, and the larger bikes (like the MZ1000S) are $195 or more. I have not seen a charge for over $250 on shipping to our shop, but if we sold new Gold Wings, that could be possible. Add on the cost of our labor ($65/hr) and we have charges ranging from $125-$260. ATV’s are the easiest to put together, and motorcycles take a great deal more time, so the labor averages out in the long run.

With all that said, let’s look at this deal Blathian is asking about. We are in KC MO, so the shipping on a baggie is around $150. Shipping to CA could be twice as much (or more) since the bikes come out of Florida. Then there is the $100 fee for assembly, which frankly, for the baggie is cheap because it takes about 2 hours to completely assemble and check out that bike. Then there is the cost of the bike itself. $5194 is a very cheap price for this bike if it’s new. The MSRP is $5995. This bike was offered so close to cost, I don’t even want to ask why the dealer was devaluing an 05 Baghira by offering it at this price. You got a good deal Blathian, and the dealer made a little money on the sale, very little. Hopefully MZ isn’t his only brand and he can stay in business for you.

And yes, I agree with the post about Seattle dealers who probably have a $50 shipping fee per bike, $600 seems pretty high for FS&S. But I don't pay his bills every month either. Also, most dealers don't have direct access to the distribution network for the big 4. It's possible those bikes are being shipped from the port of Seattle to another more regionally accessible warehouse and then the dealers must have them shipped from there. Crazier stuff happens in this business…

An excellent question. If anybody else has any questions about how a small motorcycle business is run (and how they stay alive), I'll be glad to offer my experience and opinions.

[phlat65]

I know that everyone has to earn a living. you are one of the few in this industry today that is being taken over by the huge mega store style dealership. I personally do not do buisness with any shop that I have not met the owner, or has a huge multi million dollar store. I bought my bike at a very small shop, I race off-road on a team for a small indipendant shop. I love the personal service, and don't mind paying for it. But the mega store does nothing for me. I never get to talk to the same person twice, and it sure feels like they don't apreciate me as a customer.

we have many of these new breed of super stores here in washington, and I am not happy with the route it is going.

I was racing off-road very seriously a few years ago, with a new bike each season, 15 or 20 sets of tires, chains, fluids, ect.... I don't want to think of how much I spent, but the shop wants to charge me $600 for F$S on a dirt bike? I wont shop there anymore.

[cdfisher]

Here here!

I agree completely. However, even if we had a Megastore, the values and customer service we put forth would persevere. My personal opinion is that most people on the floor represent the management views and will do what is expected of them. If that is to charge huge fees for value not delivered, then they will do it and I would vote with my feet as well.

$600 FS&S for a dirt bike is excessive and you should let the top management know your decision. I would sure want to know.

Thanks for the details, I would love to have more folks like you in our area.

[DAVID THOMPSON]

yep the big and little

Cincinnati, OH has a big fancy bmw shop

and i meet all the gang from Cincinnati, OH
at Holt bmw in athens ohio
its like a mini rally on sat...
i have been riding 50 years and what most makes and dealers
make me want to do is restore my 1960's 70' bike and go ride

[Nobog]

All I know is that when I price a bike (or anything), the price I'm quoted is the final price. I don't care if shipping is $10 or $500. I'm more leary of the low price to get you in and then hit you with the extras. You can't buy it without it being shipped can you? They don't charge you shipping on a hammer at Home Depo...
Another good one is shop supplies. One time I asked a service manager to itemize the shop supplies on an auto repair - it will never happen. Its called overhead and you build that into your product. As the Vice President of a 2 man shop (that shows you where I am at on the Totem Pole - lol!) we advertise "no hidden charges". Shop rags etc. are built into the price - very simple. Anyway, glad to see a dealer on line that will give his point of view
Jim (www.deycore.com)